Minutes From Platinum Round Table Meeting For The Southern Hemisphere 25/02/09

Date: 25th Feb 2009

Time: 7 - 7.45pm NZ Standard Time

Topic: Power Training

Welcome! You have entered [Platinum Round Table] at 6:58 pm
[getstrength] 6:58 pm: Welcome Mate
[ashley] 6:59 pm: cheers bro, let us see how this goes, eh
[getstrength] 6:59 pm: )
[Platinum Round Table]: simon has entered at 7:00 pm
[getstrength] 7:00 pm: Welcome to the Platinum Round Table Meeting
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...No swearing!
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...Please keep questions and answers brief
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...Please stick to the topic “Power Training”
[ashley] 7:00 pm: g'day simon
[getstrength] 7:00 pm: Hi Simon
[simon] 7:01 pm: Hi Guys
[ashley] 7:01 pm: you all may have seen the speeds for the tendo unit from Louie
[ashley] 7:01 pm: we have played with the percentages of max and have come up with some interesting
numbers
[getstrength] 7:02 pm: Sounds interesting
[ashley] 7:02 pm: as expected our weaker players require a lower percentage of max to reach the speeds
than our stronger lifters
[ashley] 7:03 pm: we have been using band assisted squats and have found that to acieve a speed of .6 - .7
for strength speed and using the big blue bands our experienced guys can use up to 125%
[simon] 7:04 pm: are you using the unit to program or simple as a guide mate?
[ashley] 7:04 pm: whilst our inexperienced guys will use around 90 - 100% of ther best squat
[ashley] 7:04 pm: we use the unit to get the correct weight to reach the speeds we want
[ashley] 7:05 pm: problem is we are getting average velocities and not peak velocities
[getstrength] 7:05 pm: How long have you playing with the unit? Thats huge
[ashley] 7:05 pm: just about 4 weeks now
[getstrength] 7:07 pm: Is it similar to the V-Scope
[ashley] 7:07 pm: we like to use on our thursday workout since this is our designated power day
[ashley] 7:07 pm: not really the V scope is a lot more advanced only wish I could get that to play with
and compare
[Platinum Round Table]: dunne10 has entered at 7:07 pm
[getstrength] 7:07 pm: Hi dunne10
[ashley] 7:08 pm: fire away guys
[simon] 7:08 pm: has introducing the tendo shown that you were far off in the weights that you precribed
before you had the unit to tell you the velocity?
[Platinum Round Table]: bennyryan1996 has entered at 7:09 pm
[ashley] 7:09 pm: yes mate quite a ways off as I worked on aroundf 80% forthe last workout of my cycle
being 5 x 3 @ 80% of max
[ashley] 7:09 pm: and now we may only use 60% for this workout
[ashley] 7:10 pm: also if a player is a wee bit flat we can adjust the load based on speed
[getstrength] 7:10 pm: Hi Bennyryan1996 welcome.
[bennyryan1996] 7:10 pm: hi everyone
[simon] 7:10 pm: That can be a fair difference for the stronger guys
[dunne10] 7:10 pm: What are the best exercises to incorporate into a speed power program to improve
acceleration/of the mark explosive speed for a half back?
[ashley] 7:11 pm: hey there, just read thorugh the previous repsonses to bring yourselves up to date with
where we are
[ashley] 7:11 pm: all olympic movments
[dunne10] 7:11 pm: Cool
[ashley] 7:11 pm: squats as well but done dynamically
[bennyryan1996] 7:11 pm: power clean has been shown to correlate with acceleration of the mark
[ashley] 7:12 pm: always attempt accelerate the concentric
[ashley] 7:12 pm: no matter what the load
[ashley] 7:13 pm: also plyometric movements, repeat jumps, box jumps rebound jumps
[ashley] 7:13 pm: we often use these as contrasts to our weight movements
[getstrength] 7:14 pm: Ash do you still prescribe Wide Stance Speed Box Squats?
[dunne10] 7:14 pm: Cheers, exactly what I was looking for.
[ashley] 7:14 pm: we have never done wide stance, always normal stance
[ashley] 7:14 pm: but yes they are a mainstay of our program
[ashley] 7:14 pm: especially with bands, or chains or weight releasers
[ashley] 7:15 pm: on our power day we have 4 racks set up
[getstrength] 7:15 pm: So a narrow to shoulder width stance? Why not the wide stance? To hard on the
hips?
[ashley] 7:16 pm: one for band box squats one for band assisted squats, one for jump squats and one
for 1/4 explosive squats
[ashley] 7:16 pm: yes mate the hips gte hammered and we do not wear support briefs
[ashley] 7:16 pm: alos we are a running sport
[bennyryan1996] 7:17 pm: Hey Ash, ive read that box sqauts can be pretty dangerous if your technique
is bad? do you have any technical pointers to avoid chronic or acute injury?
[ashley] 7:18 pm: really what they say at west side, really keep the chest up puch the hips backl not
down and keep tight
[getstrength] 7:18 pm: Yea thats a important point, wide stance squatting is done with a power brief or
power suit.lot of people don't realise this when writing there program for athletes.
[ashley] 7:18 pm: don't realx on the box and try not to rock back
[ashley] 7:19 pm: pause on the box then explode with al you have coming off the box
[simon] 7:19 pm: Its amazing how many guys relax on the box, keeping the trunk 'tight' is critical
[bennyryan1996] 7:20 pm: oh ok
[ashley] 7:20 pm: yes mate they just collapse through the core and it is al over
[getstrength] 7:20 pm: Thats for sure
[dunne10] 7:20 pm: When performing box ups as a contrast what is the difference between seated to
box jump and standing to box jump with regards to what they are achieving?
[ashley] 7:20 pm: The band assisted work has been great
[ashley] 7:21 pm: at least 10 - 15 cms less with the seated version
[ashley] 7:22 pm: it has taken us about 3 years to get to depth jumps versions so hasten slowly as you
move up th eintensity continuum
[dunne10] 7:22 pm: Bu do they b***h achieve them same thing with regards actual power development?
[getstrength] 7:22 pm: Ash how many of your athletes train in weightlifting shoes, not sneakers?
[getstrength] 7:23 pm: Sorry jumped in
[ashley] 7:23 pm: dunne I do not really know as we would need a force platform to accurately arses s
that is on my shopping list
[dunne10] 7:23 pm: No worries
[ashley] 7:24 pm: we only have about 3 in shoes, we are in discussion with adidas to get all in shoes a
once off issue when they become super rugby players
[ashley] 7:24 pm: they make a huge difference
[simon] 7:25 pm: I've managed to get nearly all of my boys into weightlifting shoes, adidas finally came
to the party! Makes a massive difference
[ashley] 7:25 pm: yes you do not take the field in running shoes so why go to the gym in them
[getstrength] 7:26 pm: Its still amazes me, they play rugby in rugby boots they should be weight lifting in
weight lifting shoes. Yes its makes a huge differents,
[dunne10] 7:26 pm: What about when you perform contrast sets, do you have to change shoes
[getstrength] 7:26 pm: Hahah good point
[ashley] 7:26 pm: cost is the major factor
[ashley] 7:26 pm: yes indeed we change every set
[getstrength] 7:26 pm: true. good ponit
[simon] 7:27 pm: Going back a step, any trouble with tight piriformis from box squatting?
[ashley] 7:27 pm: I am hopeful that we will have all our guys inthem next off season
[ashley] 7:28 pm: not really if it is tight stretch it and get it massaged do not use it as an excuse not to
box squat
[simon] 7:28 pm: Fair point
[dunne10] 7:29 pm: Using a tennis ball to loosen out your piriformis is good. Check out the video on
youtube of how to do it
[ashley] 7:29 pm: there are quite a few doctors and physios out there that remove exercises out of
programs at the first sign of a slight problem
[ashley] 7:29 pm: luckily we do not have them
[ashley] 7:29 pm: yes fair point even better with a golf ball in a rugby sock
[simon] 7:30 pm: The bain of my life mate, especially when it comes from those that have never lifted!
[ashley] 7:30 pm: that accounts for most of them
[ashley] 7:31 pm: most are aerobic athletes or nothing at all
[getstrength] 7:31 pm: Yes we all love them arm chair weight lifters
[dunne10] 7:33 pm: I know core stability and strength are vital for any movement. What are your favourites to use
[simon] 7:33 pm: Its the great challenge of programming for rugby, yes we are a running sport, but its no good being super fit if you can't win the
collisions
[Platinum Round Table]: callummahoney has entered at 7:34 pm
[ashley] 7:34 pm: any ideas on ballistic speeds, I have data on speed strength at .8 - 1.0 metres per second, and strength speed at .6 - .7 m/sec but
nothing on ballistics
[getstrength] 7:34 pm: Hi Callummahoney, welcome
[ashley] 7:34 pm: as to core we try and get most of our training through lifting
[simon] 7:35 pm: Sorry mate, haven't seen any data for ballistic speed
[ashley] 7:35 pm: loaded core work rollouts, turkish get up and the like
[ashley] 7:35 pm: cheers simon, I am thinking probably 1.25 m/sec
[Platinum Round Table]: getstrength has left at 7:35 pm
[Platinum Round Table]: getstrength has entered at 7:36 pm
[ashley] 7:36 pm: since the data on power clean is 1.25 and power snatch is 1.5
[ashley] 7:36 pm: I want to look at b***h rhows and jump squats as an example
[ashley] 7:37 pm: that was b***h throws
[getstrength] 7:37 pm: thats a strange one.
[bennyryan1996] 7:37 pm: I was reading on t-nation that most of major lifts such as squats and deadlifts
have more of a posterior core development effect. Any thoughts of whether additonal anterior core work is
benificial?
[ashley] 7:37 pm: interesting blocking devise
[simon] 7:38 pm: I know that Lyn (Jones) has done a bit of work on this with some of the lifters he used to
train
[ashley] 7:38 pm: well when you squat you push out and stabilse so I would think there is a huge anterior
component as well
[bennyryan1996] 7:39 pm: sounds fair
[ashley] 7:39 pm: still believe in what Dan Baker said if you can squat 200 and power clean 140 your core
will be strong enough
[bennyryan1996] 7:40 pm: good point
[getstrength] 7:41 pm: Ok guys fire away, meeting comes to an end in 5mins
[ashley] 7:41 pm: Simon getting back to my use of the Tendo I may change my session around and
instead of week 1 being 3 x 5 at 60%, I will use 3 x 5 at a ballistic speed 1.5 m/sec
[simon] 7:41 pm: Couldn't agree more with you Ash, there's not too many top end Olympic lifters with
'weak' cores
[ashley] 7:41 pm: then week 2 will be 4 x 4 at speed strength speed .8 - 1.0 m/sec
[getstrength] 7:42 pm: what a tool to have mate
[ashley] 7:42 pm: and week 3 will be 5 x 3 at strength speed .6 - .7 m/sec
[ashley] 7:42 pm: yes it is a wonderful device and relatively inexpensive\
[simon] 7:43 pm: What effect will that have on the weight used? I do something similar with the boys but at
this stage it is like yourself before the tendo based on % and my eye
[ashley] 7:44 pm: well it will indiviualise to each player as to where they are at that point in time
[ashley] 7:44 pm: far more accurate but a trained eye is still required
[dunne10] 7:44 pm: In the off season how many lower body speed power sessions would you perform a week?
ashley] 7:45 pm: depends on who you are how long you have been training and what is your position
[ashley] 7:45 pm: but roughly 1 or 2 a week
[getstrength] 7:45 pm: Last question guys!
[dunne10] 7:45 pm: Half back 3 years
[ashley] 7:45 pm: okay guys time for me to go to bed
[simon] 7:45 pm: I like how it allows you to be totally specific
[ashley] 7:45 pm: 1 a week for you dunne
[ashley] 7:46 pm: concentrate on getting bigger and stornger aqt the same time
[dunne10] 7:46 pm: Cheers, good night. Thanks for all the info!!!
[ashley] 7:46 pm: sorry my spelling is in direct inverse to my speed of typing
[bennyryan1996] 7:46 pm: yeah thanks for the info, cya later
[getstrength] 7:46 pm: Thank you all for coming.
[Platinum Round Table]: ashley has left at 7:47 pm
[simon] 7:47 pm: Thanks fellas
[bennyryan1996] 7:47 pm: Im off too, thanks everyone bye

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